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« If not Annapolis, what then? | Main | I Kill Jew! »

April 02, 2008

Comments

Ariel

Perhaps someone should ask him if he and the Pro-Palistinian lobby acknowledges and considers Palestinian and Arab massacres against Israeli's or at the time Palestinian Jews, e.g. the Hebron massacres, the May Day massacre, Gush Etzion etc.

Interstingly enough it will be the 60th anniversery of the Gush Etzion massacre on the 13th of May.

Steve

No Ariel, massacres by Arabs of Jews are not ever considered by Kasrils. If anything he celebrates them as brave acts of resistance.

I think we should write some letters to the press about the 60th anniversary of the Kfar Etzion massacre because they will be full with the Palestinian cries of mssacre.

From wikipedia
When the hopelessness of their position became undeniable on May 13, the defenders of Kfar Etzion laid down their arms and attempted to surrender.
The Israeli histories of the Kfar Etzion massacre (such as Levi, 1986, Isseroff, 2005) note that the defenders had put out the white flag and lined up to surrender in front of the school building of the German monastery. There were 133 people there. After they were photographed by a man in a kaffiyeh, an armored car apparently belonging to the Jordanian legion opened fire with its machine gun, and then Arab irregulars joined in. A group of defenders managed to crawl into the cellar of the monastery, where they defended themselves until a large number of grenades were thrown into the cellar. The building was then blown up and collapsed on them.
A total of 157 defenders died in the battle of Gush Etzion (Levi, 1986), including those killed in the massacre at Kfar Etzion.

Ariel

I agree Steve, that was the point I was trying to make.

BLACKLISTED DICTATOR

Dear Ronno Einstein,
Where are you holding Passover prayers? I like a really good meal and haven't been invited to "Slave Lodge"...any chance of a "free" seat at your table?
viva,
The Blacklisted Dictator.

Gary

Letter to the Star


Our local Stalinist relic and anti-Israel hatemonger, Ronnie Kasrils (The Star, 1 April 2008) , launches into yet another venomous and vicious diatribe directed at Israel and her people, mentioning another litany of supposed crimes against his beloved Palestinians, including the distorted propaganda about the Arabs killed at Deir Yassin in 1948, in retaliation for earlier Arab atrocities against Jews.


Kasrils has never, even in passing, condemmned the killing of Jewish men, women and children by the bloodthirsty terrorists of Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad, the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades and the PFLP.
Indeed he terms the killing by Arabs of Jewish women and children as "resistance", which clearly amounts to condoning Arab atrocities against Jews.


25 000 Jews have been murdered by Arabs in Israel since the Arabs started their pogroms against Jews in the 1920s.
Since Arafat started the 'Intifada' 7 years ago, thousands of Jewish men, women and children have been murdered by bomb, bullet, fire and knife.

In April, 2002 a five year old Jewish girl, Danielle Shefi was shot to death by Arab infiltrators into her parents home, as she cowered under her bed.
In 2004 a pregnant Jewish mother and her four terrified small daughters, were shot dead at point blank range by Arab terrorists.
A Jewish baby, Shalhevet Pass was shot dead in her father's arms by an Arab sniper in 2001.
There have been thousands of attacks such as these, that Kasrils terms resistance.

What about the massacre of Israeli children at Maalot in 1974, or the suicide bombing outside the Dolphin Disco in 2002, in which 21 teenagers. mainly girls, were burned to death after an Arab suicide attack?. This is only the tip of the iceberg.

And Kasrils terms this resistance. I suppose it should be no surprise that a confirmed Stalinist has no conscience.
The world needs more Stalinists like it needs a hole in the head.
The meaning of Israel is clear. The Jew has experienced too much death, and a portion of the Jewish people decided that they would die quietly no more (especially after Hitler's Holocaust). So it is: and no argument, no clever political talk, no logic and no parading of right and wrong can change this fact .The Jews returned to Israel because it was their ancient land. From 1810 onwards, Jews in the Land of Israel have been murdered by Arabs. The pious Jews of Safed, who would raise no hand in their defence, were robbed and murdered and burned out again and again by Arabs - as were the Jews in Jerusalem and Tiberias. Arabs passed through the Land of Israel at will-and robbed and killed Jews for profit. In the nineteenth and twentieth centuries, Arab feudal lords in the Land of Israel organized pogroms precisely as the Tsar had organized pogroms.

In 1920 Jews were massacred by Arabs in Jerusalem, in 1921 in Jaffa and in 1929 in Hebron. Thousands of Jews where murdered in 1936 to 1939 in the Nazi inspired Arab Revolt. Since 1948 Arabs have launched wars against Israel to try to drive Jews into the sea. Jews will never again be put into a position where they can be subjected to another Holocaust (particularly in the ancient Jewish homeland).
There can be no talk of peace until the world realizes Israeli Jews are also entitled to human rights!

Gary Selikow

BLACKLISTED DICTATOR

Gary,
Excellent letter to The Star. I particularly like the following bit ...

"The meaning of Israel is clear. The Jew has experienced too much death, and a portion of the Jewish people decided that they would die quietly no more (especially after Hitler's Holocaust). So it is: and no argument, no clever political talk, no logic and no parading of right and wrong can change this fact" (Selikow)

JoeTalin

The Arabs don't massacre the Jews, and never have. This is Zionist propoganda used by Israel to justify the building of their Apartheid wall.

These so called 'rockets' being launched into Israel are also a falicy. These wild stories are being used by the Occupier to gain sympathy from the West. Kassam is actually a Hebrew word, and the direct translation is:
'Make up stories about the Palestinians so that Israel can launch raids and turn off the electricity in Gaza'.
You can look that up in a Hebrew/English dictionary, if you like.

Brett

Say what you want about old Ron, he knws the rules of propaganda - either make a lie so big that it must be true since noone would have the audacity to try bluff the public so balantly, or make sure what you say is close to the truth but change small but crtical details - he would make Goebels proud.

I think Ronnie usually goes for the former but here it seems the latter is the approach of this letter.

He claims Israel has put a siege on Gaza - technically true, but it is not because of one Israeli soldier (may be returned safely home soon), although in my opinion that would be enough, it is because when an enemy entity is attacking you you don't carry on providing the means for them to carry out these attacks. He claims collective punishment. Firstly (and I look forward to the bombardment I will receive for this) but who ever said collective punishment is a bad thing. I your people, in your name, with your backing are committing a crime, then even if you were not directly responsible, if an action that will reduce that crime will affect you, why should it not be justified. I didn't hear the ANC condemning sanctions against Apartheid SA becuase there were some white people that weren't directly involved in the oppression and some who even voted PFP! Bing part of a community and enjoying the benefits of communal living means communal responsibility.
Secondly, collective punishment's connotation is that of punishing the innocent. Leaving the above argument aside, Hamas was democratically elected on the platform if "We want to destroy Israel".

We then get the lie - 1500 Lebanese civilians killed - last time I checked carrying an AK and shooting Sagar rockets kind of revokes your civilian status.

What siege of the West Bank exactly? Yes there are raod blocks and check points, but unless your packing C4 for lunch you can pass. The long lines - well excuse us for checking you for weapons that you publicly claim you want to kill us with. I think the key point with the check points is that WE LET PALESTINIANS COME INTO ISRAEL IN THE FIRST PLACE! The thousands of potential murderers that enter everyday could easily be replaced by Jewish workers and things would be alot easier for us if there were no check points at all.

"Years of death and destruction in west bank" - The West bank, as is Gaza has received electrification, sewerage, increased ave. household income and decreased infant mortality rate (the last 2 I read a while ago I say now I cannot back up with numbers) that before 1967.

"Disproportionate" - My favorite. It is the most illogical concept I have ever heard. If someone attacks you with a knife you defend yourself with whatever you have and if that happens to out gun his knife how is this unethical. What the UN, ANC ect mean when thay say disproportionate is "Look, we can see that they are trying to kill and whilst we are quite happy with that we can't say so in public so we are going to ask you to not respond properly." What exactly is this proportionate response? There was a cooment in JPost while ago that Israel should provide all those people within range of Gaza the materials and training to build homemade rockets and let them fire at will. Perhaps when Ronnie says proportionate he means do what they do - so if they fire 10 rockets at Sderot today then on the same day, we fire 10 similar rockets at them, and if 1 landed in a school in Sderot, we aim one at one of their schools - I think not.

Brett

Say what you want about old Ron, he knws the rules of propaganda - either make a lie so big that it must be true since noone would have the audacity to try bluff the public so balantly, or make sure what you say is close to the truth but change small but crtical details - he would make Goebels proud.

I think Ronnie usually goes for the former but here it seems the latter is the approach of this letter.

He claims Israel has put a siege on Gaza - technically true, but it is not because of one Israeli soldier (may be returned safely home soon), although in my opinion that would be enough, it is because when an enemy entity is attacking you you don't carry on providing the means for them to carry out these attacks. He claims collective punishment. Firstly (and I look forward to the bombardment I will receive for this) but who ever said collective punishment is a bad thing. I your people, in your name, with your backing are committing a crime, then even if you were not directly responsible, if an action that will reduce that crime will affect you, why should it not be justified. I didn't hear the ANC condemning sanctions against Apartheid SA becuase there were some white people that weren't directly involved in the oppression and some who even voted PFP! Bing part of a community and enjoying the benefits of communal living means communal responsibility.
Secondly, collective punishment's connotation is that of punishing the innocent. Leaving the above argument aside, Hamas was democratically elected on the platform if "We want to destroy Israel".

We then get the lie - 1500 Lebanese civilians killed - last time I checked carrying an AK and shooting Sagar rockets kind of revokes your civilian status.

What siege of the West Bank exactly? Yes there are raod blocks and check points, but unless your packing C4 for lunch you can pass. The long lines - well excuse us for checking you for weapons that you publicly claim you want to kill us with. I think the key point with the check points is that WE LET PALESTINIANS COME INTO ISRAEL IN THE FIRST PLACE! The thousands of potential murderers that enter everyday could easily be replaced by Jewish workers and things would be alot easier for us if there were no check points at all.

"Years of death and destruction in west bank" - The West bank, as is Gaza has received electrification, sewerage, increased ave. household income and decreased infant mortality rate (the last 2 I read a while ago I say now I cannot back up with numbers) that before 1967.

"Disproportionate" - My favorite. It is the most illogical concept I have ever heard. If someone attacks you with a knife you defend yourself with whatever you have and if that happens to out gun his knife how is this unethical. What the UN, ANC ect mean when thay say disproportionate is "Look, we can see that they are trying to kill and whilst we are quite happy with that we can't say so in public so we are going to ask you to not respond properly." What exactly is this proportionate response? There was a cooment in JPost while ago that Israel should provide all those people within range of Gaza the materials and training to build homemade rockets and let them fire at will. Perhaps when Ronnie says proportionate he means do what they do - so if they fire 10 rockets at Sderot today then on the same day, we fire 10 similar rockets at them, and if 1 landed in a school in Sderot, we aim one at one of their schools - I think not.

Brett

Say what you want about old Ron, he knws the rules of propaganda - either make a lie so big that it must be true since noone would have the audacity to try bluff the public so balantly, or make sure what you say is close to the truth but change small but crtical details - he would make Goebels proud.

I think Ronnie usually goes for the former but here it seems the latter is the approach of this letter.

He claims Israel has put a siege on Gaza - technically true, but it is not because of one Israeli soldier (may be returned safely home soon), although in my opinion that would be enough, it is because when an enemy entity is attacking you you don't carry on providing the means for them to carry out these attacks. He claims collective punishment. Firstly (and I look forward to the bombardment I will receive for this) but who ever said collective punishment is a bad thing. I your people, in your name, with your backing are committing a crime, then even if you were not directly responsible, if an action that will reduce that crime will affect you, why should it not be justified. I didn't hear the ANC condemning sanctions against Apartheid SA becuase there were some white people that weren't directly involved in the oppression and some who even voted PFP! Bing part of a community and enjoying the benefits of communal living means communal responsibility.
Secondly, collective punishment's connotation is that of punishing the innocent. Leaving the above argument aside, Hamas was democratically elected on the platform if "We want to destroy Israel".

We then get the lie - 1500 Lebanese civilians killed - last time I checked carrying an AK and shooting Sagar rockets kind of revokes your civilian status.

What siege of the West Bank exactly? Yes there are raod blocks and check points, but unless your packing C4 for lunch you can pass. The long lines - well excuse us for checking you for weapons that you publicly claim you want to kill us with. I think the key point with the check points is that WE LET PALESTINIANS COME INTO ISRAEL IN THE FIRST PLACE! The thousands of potential murderers that enter everyday could easily be replaced by Jewish workers and things would be alot easier for us if there were no check points at all.

"Years of death and destruction in west bank" - The West bank, as is Gaza has received electrification, sewerage, increased ave. household income and decreased infant mortality rate (the last 2 I read a while ago I say now I cannot back up with numbers) that before 1967.

"Disproportionate" - My favorite. It is the most illogical concept I have ever heard. If someone attacks you with a knife you defend yourself with whatever you have and if that happens to out gun his knife how is this unethical. What the UN, ANC ect mean when thay say disproportionate is "Look, we can see that they are trying to kill and whilst we are quite happy with that we can't say so in public so we are going to ask you to not respond properly." What exactly is this proportionate response? There was a cooment in JPost while ago that Israel should provide all those people within range of Gaza the materials and training to build homemade rockets and let them fire at will. Perhaps when Ronnie says proportionate he means do what they do - so if they fire 10 rockets at Sderot today then on the same day, we fire 10 similar rockets at them, and if 1 landed in a school in Sderot, we aim one at one of their schools - I think not.

Brett

Say what you want about old Ron, he knws the rules of propaganda - either make a lie so big that it must be true since noone would have the audacity to try bluff the public so balantly, or make sure what you say is close to the truth but change small but crtical details - he would make Goebels proud.

I think Ronnie usually goes for the former but here it seems the latter is the approach of this letter.

He claims Israel has put a siege on Gaza - technically true, but it is not because of one Israeli soldier (may be returned safely home soon), although in my opinion that would be enough, it is because when an enemy entity is attacking you you don't carry on providing the means for them to carry out these attacks. He claims collective punishment. Firstly (and I look forward to the bombardment I will receive for this) but who ever said collective punishment is a bad thing. I your people, in your name, with your backing are committing a crime, then even if you were not directly responsible, if an action that will reduce that crime will affect you, why should it not be justified. I didn't hear the ANC condemning sanctions against Apartheid SA becuase there were some white people that weren't directly involved in the oppression and some who even voted PFP! Bing part of a community and enjoying the benefits of communal living means communal responsibility.
Secondly, collective punishment's connotation is that of punishing the innocent. Leaving the above argument aside, Hamas was democratically elected on the platform if "We want to destroy Israel".

We then get the lie - 1500 Lebanese civilians killed - last time I checked carrying an AK and shooting Sagar rockets kind of revokes your civilian status.

What siege of the West Bank exactly? Yes there are raod blocks and check points, but unless your packing C4 for lunch you can pass. The long lines - well excuse us for checking you for weapons that you publicly claim you want to kill us with. I think the key point with the check points is that WE LET PALESTINIANS COME INTO ISRAEL IN THE FIRST PLACE! The thousands of potential murderers that enter everyday could easily be replaced by Jewish workers and things would be alot easier for us if there were no check points at all.

"Years of death and destruction in west bank" - The West bank, as is Gaza has received electrification, sewerage, increased ave. household income and decreased infant mortality rate (the last 2 I read a while ago I say now I cannot back up with numbers) that before 1967.

"Disproportionate" - My favorite. It is the most illogical concept I have ever heard. If someone attacks you with a knife you defend yourself with whatever you have and if that happens to out gun his knife how is this unethical. What the UN, ANC ect mean when thay say disproportionate is "Look, we can see that they are trying to kill and whilst we are quite happy with that we can't say so in public so we are going to ask you to not respond properly." What exactly is this proportionate response? There was a cooment in JPost while ago that Israel should provide all those people within range of Gaza the materials and training to build homemade rockets and let them fire at will. Perhaps when Ronnie says proportionate he means do what they do - so if they fire 10 rockets at Sderot today then on the same day, we fire 10 similar rockets at them, and if 1 landed in a school in Sderot, we aim one at one of their schools - I think not.

Brett

I see that hitting refresh when it doesn't look like its sending it perhaps not the action of choice.

BLACKLISTED DICTATOR

Brett,
A "proportionate" response to rockets being lobbed would be...

"Would you mind awfully if you stopped, just for a few minutes, from sending your rockets into my son's school playground. I really hope that my request doesn't offend you, as I know that you don't mean any harm, but my wife is a bit of a nag and she doesn't want little David's new school uniform spoilt."

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